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Very tight Argo centreboard

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Chillidoggy View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Chillidoggy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 22 at 10:10am
The only PY I found after extensive searching was one at 1075, and one at 1090. Having sailed a Laser 2000 for years, I would put it around that kind of performance, but I have no proof whatsoever, it's just a feeling, and I have no idea how one would arrive at a calculated figure.
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A2Z View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote A2Z Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 22 at 3:11pm
Originally posted by Sam.Spoons

It is 8" longer than a L@ser Vago with a bigger rig and weighs about the same. The Vago had a PN of 1074 in 2016 so the Argo should be slightly faster*. That said my Fuller Formula spreadsheet gives a Fuller Number for the Vago of 1148 and for the Argo of 1080. Those numbers maybe a bit generous but I think around 1100 would be a good starting point if you can persuade your race committee...

* Just looked at the RS Venture (bigger) and Quest (smaller) and Great Lakes give them 1080 and 1130 respectively so 1100 seems about right for the Argo.

The Fuller number is only valid for conventional singlehanders.  Use it here at considerable risk!
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 22 at 3:23pm
Agreed, though I think it is still useful as a starting point for a boat with no published PN. My spreadsheet actually predicts the Blaze at 1001, 32 less than it's actual numbers but the Spice comes out at 926 so only 4 points below it's last PN (which is IMO about 30 points too low). When I get the time I'll put a few more two handers into the spreadsheet and see where they end up (FWIW it predicts 1047 for the Vago when it's last PN was 1074). I suspect the general upward creep in PNs means that an annual adjustment to the formula will be necessary. Mostly though it's just a bit of fun (just like handicap racing).

Edited by Sam.Spoons - 23 Jun 22 at 6:36pm
Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
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ColPrice2002 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ColPrice2002 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 22 at 5:13pm
Hi,

Glad you sorted out the centreboard problem - I suspect it's easy to just ad another strip rather than dig out the old ones!

Sail training centre I worked for had Argos - sailing with Jib and Mainsail was fairly pedestrian, ir's a heavy dinghy so it doesn't accelerate quickly, but is pretty stable. The Genniker, however, is huge! It seemed to be larger than main+jib so using that downwind will make a huge difference to the PY rating.
The Argo is part of the Topper products - their brochure give PY = 1095. There's no information on the RYA site.
The Argo is used for lots of training - perhaps it's not used for racing that much.

Colin
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 22 at 5:18pm
Having raced a 2000 against Argos and an Argo against 2000s, I can safely say the Argo is somewhat slower. Whilst the weight and length are similar, the hull is more flexible, the rig smaller and the main lacking the same power. Nice boat, though - the only one of the bigger roto boats I'd say that about, really, though I've not sailed the Quest enough to have an opinion.
Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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ClubRacer View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ClubRacer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 22 at 6:14pm
topper brochure has it listed at 1095
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Sam.Spoons View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Sam.Spoons Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 22 at 6:24pm
So the FN is not that far off  LOL 

FWIW The white sails total 11.4m2 and the kite is 10.6 so about the same as the Quest and the 2000.


Edited by Sam.Spoons - 23 Jun 22 at 6:30pm
Spice 346 "Flat Broke"
Blaze 671 "supersonic soap dish"
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Rupert View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Rupert Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Jun 22 at 7:54pm
As usual, numbers only tell half the story, which is why the PYS is results based. Go sailing, see how you go as you get up to speed. But get that centreboard fixed first!
Firefly 2324, Puffin 229, Minisail 3446 Mirror 70686
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Post Options Post Options   Quote Chillidoggy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 Jun 22 at 8:22am
The centreboard is fixed. Smile

I've agreed on 1095, with adjustments to results be made if necessary, or if RYA issues a PY for the Argo. From reading the replies, looking at sail areas quoted and your first-hand experiences, I'm thinking that the Argo gennaker is kind of its 'secret weapon', to be launched when possible to make up any lost time elsewhere!

Once again, thanks to all of you for taking time to comment.
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ColPrice2002 View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Quote ColPrice2002 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 Jun 22 at 9:07am
When I was instructing, the centre had a couple of Argos - we did have to have the floor strengthened - maybe they were early hulls,  maybe we used them hard, but the floors need reinforcing.
The "fun" activity was setting the jib tension - crew climbed onto the trolley handle and leant back on the forestay; crew 2 sweated up the halyard. Then you release the forestay, untie it and secure it near the mast. If there isn't enough jib tension you won't sail closehauled very well.
I always put a piece of electrical tape over the jib halyard cleat to prevent me from releasing it without thinking... "must reattach the forestay!" - otherwise the rig just hinges backwards.
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